Bolleli and Cooper - Melian Dialogue
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:53 pm
http://historyonfirepodcast.com/episode ... in-history
Very good podcast with Danielle Bolleli of Hardcore History and Darryl Cooper of Martyrmade.
To sum up.
Thucydides wrote a "proposed" dialogue between the Athenians and the Melians that where essentially the Melians were given the choice submit of die. When the Melians protested their "rights" as free citizens the Athenians essentially laughed and made no pretence other than "might makes right" and the weak suffer what they must - so choose.
The Melians chose resistance and ultimately death... with all it's murder, rape and cruelty.
Meanwhile Euripedes staged a play "The Trojan Women" which gave the perspective of the victims of war and was granted a prize in the city of Athens.
Bollelli and Cooper talk it out.
What is nobler - hypocrisy i.e. aggression under the veil of virtuosity or honest aggression?
A fascinating debate takes place... with something of a vacillating conclusion... but fascinating none the less.
I was struck by Cooper's dismissal of the "intellectual dark web"... a stupid term for a group of pretty respectable thinkers.
I actually think Peterson and company would all participate fluidly in this conversation and flesh it out even further.
I want to comment on Cooper's criticism of Peterson's position on postmodernists.
I don't think Peterson is saying their critique of power is unjustified or a sign of weakness in and of itself as Nietsche was...
I think Peterson draws the line at the postmodern dismissal of ANY moral authority whatsoever (complete moral relativism) and the view of authority itself as inherently suspect and immoral.
I see Cooper as a member of the "intellectual dark web"... but he's probably been too busy rereading the Illiad to carefully explore their arguments.
Very good podcast with Danielle Bolleli of Hardcore History and Darryl Cooper of Martyrmade.
To sum up.
Thucydides wrote a "proposed" dialogue between the Athenians and the Melians that where essentially the Melians were given the choice submit of die. When the Melians protested their "rights" as free citizens the Athenians essentially laughed and made no pretence other than "might makes right" and the weak suffer what they must - so choose.
The Melians chose resistance and ultimately death... with all it's murder, rape and cruelty.
Meanwhile Euripedes staged a play "The Trojan Women" which gave the perspective of the victims of war and was granted a prize in the city of Athens.
Bollelli and Cooper talk it out.
What is nobler - hypocrisy i.e. aggression under the veil of virtuosity or honest aggression?
A fascinating debate takes place... with something of a vacillating conclusion... but fascinating none the less.
I was struck by Cooper's dismissal of the "intellectual dark web"... a stupid term for a group of pretty respectable thinkers.
I actually think Peterson and company would all participate fluidly in this conversation and flesh it out even further.
I want to comment on Cooper's criticism of Peterson's position on postmodernists.
I don't think Peterson is saying their critique of power is unjustified or a sign of weakness in and of itself as Nietsche was...
I think Peterson draws the line at the postmodern dismissal of ANY moral authority whatsoever (complete moral relativism) and the view of authority itself as inherently suspect and immoral.
I see Cooper as a member of the "intellectual dark web"... but he's probably been too busy rereading the Illiad to carefully explore their arguments.
